| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:49 |
|
pdurbin |
oh, as an alternative to hadoop or spark, I meant to say |
| 01:54 |
|
pdurbin |
hearing about http://blog.jessitron.com/2015/04/charting-team-course-with-seamap.html which is interesting |
| 05:49 |
|
prologic |
aditsu: What do you think of https://github.com/prologic/domains ? |
| 08:23 |
|
|
sivoais joined #sourcefu |
| 09:55 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: it's not very clear to me what it does |
| 09:57 |
|
prologic |
are you serious? |
| 09:58 |
|
prologic |
please help me make it clearer then! |
| 09:58 |
|
aditsu |
I would have to understand it first, in order to help |
| 09:59 |
|
prologic |
okay let me ask in a different way |
| 09:59 |
|
prologic |
what's *not* clear? |
| 09:59 |
|
aditsu |
oh, that's gonna take a while to write :p |
| 10:00 |
|
* prologic |
sigh |
| 10:00 |
|
aditsu |
first, how are the cloud providers related to the domains? |
| 10:00 |
|
aditsu |
what is domains.yml? |
| 10:00 |
|
aditsu |
what does synchronizing the configuration mean? |
| 10:01 |
|
aditsu |
where is the dns server? |
| 10:01 |
|
aditsu |
etc etc |
| 10:01 |
|
prologic |
great! Thank you! |
| 10:01 |
|
prologic |
okay that last one was silly :P |
| 10:01 |
|
prologic |
dns is provided by the cloud providers |
| 10:01 |
|
aditsu |
oh |
| 10:02 |
|
aditsu |
I never used that (except, I guess, for reverse dns) |
| 10:03 |
|
aditsu |
can "cloud" providers host the dns for my domain? I wasn't aware of that |
| 10:04 |
|
prologic |
tracking here https://github.com/prologic/domains/issues/2 |
| 10:04 |
|
aditsu |
I just logged in to rackspace, where is the dns stuff? |
| 10:06 |
|
aditsu |
I think I found something... at Networking -> Cloud DNS |
| 10:07 |
|
aditsu |
never seen that before :p and I don't know what it does |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
yes I've already gathered you have little to no interest in cloud hosting services and you prefer metal installations and Gentoo |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
:) |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
yes! |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
in fact many do |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
and for free |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
well most for free |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
AWS's Route53 charges you per dns lookup on your domain from ohters |
| 10:08 |
|
prologic |
so if your domain is never used you pay $0 |
| 10:09 |
|
aditsu |
hmm, seems to be regular DNS hosting |
| 10:09 |
|
prologic |
should be a gui for it |
| 10:09 |
|
prologic |
there certainly is an API |
| 10:09 |
|
prologic |
that'd be the one |
| 10:09 |
|
prologic |
better get learning then! |
| 10:10 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: I have an interest in VPS'es, I don't rely on "metal" (and I dislike the term "cloud") |
| 10:10 |
|
aditsu |
Gentoo is orthogonal with that |
| 10:11 |
|
aditsu |
I usually hosted DNS at the registrar, but more recently I switched to a 3rd party service (he.net) |
| 10:12 |
|
aditsu |
better get learning what? |
| 10:19 |
|
prologic |
useless internet |
| 10:19 |
|
pdurbin |
aditsu: do you rack the physical servers yourself? |
| 10:20 |
|
aditsu |
pdurbin: like colocation? no |
| 10:20 |
|
prologic |
I missed a bit of convo |
| 10:21 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: check the logs then |
| 10:22 |
|
pdurbin |
aditsu said he uses a mix of physical servers and VPS'es: http://irclog.greptilian.com/sourcefu/2015-07-07#i_124999 |
| 10:22 |
|
prologic |
ahh I missed nothing |
| 10:22 |
|
aditsu |
yes, there's 1 or 2 physical servers at a company I'm working with |
| 10:22 |
|
aditsu |
in the office |
| 10:23 |
|
prologic |
I was trying to say you can't/shouldn't not like the term cloud |
| 10:23 |
|
prologic |
regardless of what we've called it |
| 10:23 |
|
prologic |
it's here to say :P |
| 10:23 |
|
prologic |
stay* |
| 10:23 |
|
pdurbin |
oh, sure. I guess I mean personal stuff. I just have one little VM, hosted by codex :) |
| 10:23 |
|
prologic |
move em to the cloud! |
| 10:24 |
|
prologic |
aditsu, also you need to update your website :) |
| 10:24 |
|
prologic |
it's a big old looking :P |
| 10:24 |
|
prologic |
and you haven't written a blog post since ~2001 |
| 10:24 |
|
prologic |
2011* |
| 10:24 |
|
pdurbin |
I think he's been busy writing programming languages. |
| 10:24 |
|
aditsu |
for personal stuff.. I have a 2 VPS'es (and the computers at home, but not really hosting stuff here) |
| 10:25 |
|
prologic |
a programming language? |
| 10:25 |
|
prologic |
do tell |
| 10:25 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: https://sourceforge.net/projects/cjam/ |
| 10:25 |
|
aditsu |
I'm mostly busy wasting time.. anyway, I agree about the site (and it's not a blog), but it's not high priority |
| 10:26 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic wrote one too. based on Io or something? |
| 10:27 |
|
aditsu |
oh, and I only really want one VPS, but haven't had time to move everything yet :p |
| 10:28 |
|
prologic |
right |
| 10:28 |
|
prologic |
an esoteric language |
| 10:29 |
|
prologic |
pdurbin, I've in fact written three langauges so far |
| 10:29 |
|
* pdurbin |
hasn't written any |
| 10:29 |
|
prologic |
getting better every time I write a new one :P |
| 10:30 |
|
aditsu |
I suppose it's esoteric, but I also use it for practical stuff (as an extension to grep and replacement for sed/perl/awk/whatever) |
| 10:32 |
|
pdurbin |
I use ack a lot: http://beyondgrep.com |
| 10:32 |
|
prologic |
I use grin https://pypi.python.org/pypi/grin |
| 10:32 |
|
prologic |
:P |
| 10:34 |
|
prologic |
http://mio-lang.readthedocs.org/en/latest/ |
| 10:36 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: so anyway, your tool seems to assume the DNS is hosted by the "cloud" hosting provider, right? is that a necessary assumption, or would it theoretically work with any DNS hosting provider? |
| 10:37 |
|
pdurbin |
aditsu: I think you're right. |
| 10:37 |
|
aditsu |
of course I am :) about what? :p |
| 10:38 |
|
prologic |
aditsu, yes and thanks |
| 10:38 |
|
pdurbin |
aditsu: so you'd want to tool that handles both cloud configs and local BIND configs? |
| 10:38 |
|
pdurbin |
a* tool |
| 10:38 |
|
prologic |
you have to point your domain(s) at whatever cloud provider you wish to use |
| 10:39 |
|
prologic |
I'm developing such a tool too |
| 10:39 |
|
prologic |
domains-import-bind |
| 10:39 |
|
prologic |
which will convert bind zone formats into the yaml format that domains understand |
| 10:39 |
|
prologic |
for syncing to a cloud provider |
| 10:39 |
|
aditsu |
pdurbin: not necessarily, although that would be a bonus; I'd be interested in a tool that handles DNS hosting providers that don't necessarily do web hosting |
| 10:40 |
|
aditsu |
also, I'm not sure yet what the tool actually does :p |
| 10:40 |
|
prologic |
add an issue of some other dns services you want to support :P |
| 10:40 |
|
prologic |
I'll add them |
| 10:40 |
|
prologic |
it takes a yaml configuration file that deslcares the records of your domains and published them to whatever cloud provdiers youv'e specified |
| 10:40 |
|
prologic |
this is still pre 0.0.1 so bare with me |
| 10:41 |
|
prologic |
right now it's a provider per domain and a list of records |
| 10:41 |
|
aditsu |
well, godaddy, name.com and he.net come to mind |
| 10:41 |
|
prologic |
but I think it makes a lot of sense to declare and say globally; I want to use this provider for all domains |
| 10:41 |
|
prologic |
with the exception of a few domains that explicitly want to use a different provider |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
and sync here means that any changes in the domains.yml file are synchronized to the cloud dns provider |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
new records are created |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
modified records are updated |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
zones are created if they don't exist |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
aditsu, please file an issue |
| 10:42 |
|
prologic |
I'll write providers for those |
| 10:43 |
|
prologic |
apache-libcloud does not support those but libcloud tries to be a cloud agnostic library to provide compute, storage, dns, load balancing, etc to a whole bunch of cloud providers |
| 10:43 |
|
prologic |
I'm depending on their library for convenience really |
| 10:43 |
|
prologic |
happy to write custom providers for others that libcloud does not have |
| 10:43 |
|
prologic |
and likely never will |
| 10:43 |
|
aditsu |
anyway, I have to go now |
| 10:44 |
|
prologic |
I'll prod you to file an issue later then :P |
| 10:53 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic: you're tenacious about getting new customers :) |
| 10:55 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic: oh, you're still anti-mailing list, right? (except I feel like you've linked to posts you've made to the docker mailing list) a friend of mine suggested creating one about the craft of programming and we just might |
| 10:55 |
|
pdurbin |
everyone here would be invited of course! |
| 10:56 |
|
pdurbin |
and it would have public archives |
| 11:02 |
|
prologic |
no I'm not a big fan of forums |
| 11:02 |
|
prologic |
mailing lists are "okay" |
| 11:04 |
|
pdurbin |
oh! maybe it was aditsu who doesn't like mailing lists |
| 11:05 |
|
pdurbin |
for me it can't be forum only. I think Discourse allows you to post via email |
| 11:07 |
|
prologic |
I think Discourse is a good improvement on the whole forum/mailing-list problem |
| 11:07 |
|
prologic |
but yeah I agree |
| 11:07 |
|
prologic |
the thing about Forums for me is that they require active effort to get involved |
| 11:07 |
|
prologic |
which will just never happen for busy people |
| 11:07 |
|
prologic |
it's easy to just sit on IRC |
| 11:08 |
|
prologic |
everyone reads/writes/accesses email - but usually the one email ui/tool/app/whatever |
| 11:08 |
|
prologic |
but forums are "too much effort" |
| 11:08 |
|
prologic |
same reason I don't play active games either |
| 11:08 |
|
prologic |
usually only passive ones like correspondence competition chess or I infrequently choose to play realtime competition chess |
| 11:08 |
|
prologic |
usually 2m a side |
| 11:10 |
|
pdurbin |
email is good for announcing things. mostly I would email the list to link to an interesting blog post or whatever |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
well if it's a forum/milainglist type thing like Discourse |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
I would expect active threads |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
either via the web ui and/or via email |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
aka google groups |
| 11:11 |
|
pdurbin |
oh sure. normal mailing list stuff |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
but here's an idea |
| 11:11 |
|
prologic |
what about mail/forum/irc/q&a |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
all rolled into one? |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
maybe even Twitter/Google+/Facebook |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
surely there's a way we can combine all these different forms of commication into one seamless experience for a group |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
some of the concepts may not marry up so well |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
but we can surely work around that |
| 11:12 |
|
pdurbin |
sounds like a hot mess ;) |
| 11:12 |
|
prologic |
like identifying topics of conversation on irc |
| 11:13 |
|
prologic |
probably have to parse the channel text in realtime using something like nltk |
| 11:13 |
|
prologic |
and stream that to a webui of some sort |
| 11:13 |
|
prologic |
lol |
| 11:13 |
|
prologic |
well it's just really silly how we have all these forms of communications and social interactions but no way to combine them in a sensible way |
| 11:13 |
|
pdurbin |
yeah |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
for instance I use Google Talk and Twitter via bitlbee/IRC |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
why can't we do the same for forums and mailing lists |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
perhaps just start there |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
integrate iRC + Forum + Email |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
for a particular group/channel |
| 11:14 |
|
prologic |
or perhaps this could be done as a new kind of IRC server software |
| 11:15 |
|
prologic |
e.g: https://github.com/prologic/charla |
| 11:15 |
|
prologic |
where we build email/forum interfaces as well |
| 11:15 |
|
prologic |
ala Slack in the way it has a Web/Desktop/Mobile client(s) as well as XMPP/Jabber and IRC Gateways and integration's with hordes of services |
| 11:16 |
|
pdurbin |
does slack integrate with email? |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
not sure |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
not that I'm aware of |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
I'm not aware of many/any chats that do |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
but how hard could it be? |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
email/forum are quite similar |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
so my idea would be |
| 11:16 |
|
prologic |
translating the real-time nature of IRC |
| 11:17 |
|
prologic |
into the digest nature of forum/mail |
| 11:17 |
|
prologic |
and vice versa |
| 11:17 |
|
pdurbin |
when you say digest you don't mean mailman digest subscriptions |
| 11:17 |
|
prologic |
kind of |
| 11:17 |
|
prologic |
so when we're busily chatting away here |
| 11:17 |
|
prologic |
the irc server decides when to package up the contents of the channel at some snapshot |
| 11:18 |
|
prologic |
and send it off to subscribers that wish to particpate in that way |
| 11:18 |
|
prologic |
there is still of course the issue of identifying topics of conversation |
| 11:18 |
|
prologic |
usually forums have threads of conversation |
| 11:18 |
|
prologic |
and it's usually nice to have a subject in emails |
| 11:19 |
|
prologic |
but not impossible to achieve with some nltk and Bayesian learning |
| 11:19 |
|
prologic |
we could be developing the first integrated social network here :P |
| 11:19 |
|
pdurbin |
:) |
| 11:19 |
|
pdurbin |
I don't think online communication is "done". :) |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
Twitter would be easy |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
setup a Twitter account for the group |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
and it would act as a gateway |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
no neither do i |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
I think/believe there is room to improve still |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
todo apps aren't done yet either |
| 11:20 |
|
pdurbin |
Discourse was supposed to be a reboot of forums. |
| 11:20 |
|
prologic |
I have yet to find a todo app that I will actually actgively use |
| 11:21 |
|
prologic |
and share with my wife/family |
| 11:22 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic: did you read the PDF at http://people.csail.mit.edu/axz/mailinglists.html ? please consider it. |
| 11:24 |
|
prologic |
hmm |
| 11:24 |
|
prologic |
yeah |
| 11:25 |
|
prologic |
here's an idea |
| 11:25 |
|
prologic |
would it be interesting to see something that integrate IRC + Email/Mailing-List + Forum together in some way? |
| 11:32 |
|
pdurbin |
sure, could be interesting |
| 11:33 |
|
* pdurbin |
drops a link to the IRC enthusiasts: https://botbot.me/freenode/opensourcedesign/msg/44165972/ :) |
| 11:34 |
|
prologic |
(y) |
| 11:34 |
|
prologic |
well I guess I could start working on charla when I'm done with my current queue of tasks/projects |
| 11:34 |
|
* pdurbin |
drops another link: http://irclogs.jackgrigg.com/irc.freenode.net/openhatch/2015-07-10 |
| 11:36 |
|
prologic |
I'm actually revitalizing the charla project as we speak |
| 11:36 |
|
prologic |
I moved a lot/all my projects from Bitbucket ro Github in the last 6 months |
| 11:36 |
|
prologic |
so few house keeping things to do |
| 11:36 |
|
prologic |
but IIRC it *was* a mostly complete working IRC server |
| 11:37 |
|
prologic |
I actually *was* going to start adding a web interface to it |
| 11:37 |
|
prologic |
and a websockets endpoint |
| 11:37 |
|
prologic |
so may as well continue the experiment |
| 12:03 |
|
prologic |
damnit we lost our todos |
| 12:03 |
|
prologic |
I think I did that by mistake |
| 12:03 |
|
prologic |
haha |
| 12:04 |
|
prologic |
there are things we'd better learn to do well |
| 12:14 |
|
prologic |
who wants to do some testing with me? :) |
| 12:14 |
|
prologic |
/server daisy.shortcircuit.net.au 6668 |
| 12:43 |
|
prologic |
http://blitzdb.readthedocs.org/en/latest/ |
| 12:50 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic: want to jump in #opensourcedesign |
| 12:50 |
|
pdurbin |
and talk to bnvk about his dream of integrating IRC, email and forums? https://botbot.me/freenode/opensourcedesign/msg/44165972/ |
| 12:54 |
|
prologic |
lol |
| 13:20 |
|
* aditsu |
is back |
| 13:21 |
|
pdurbin |
aditsu: you're the one who doesn't like mailing lists |
| 13:21 |
|
aditsu |
I prefer forums rather than mailing lists, but email notification is important too; there are services that merge the two together, e.g. nabble |
| 13:22 |
|
aditsu |
if you want to integrate everything, don't forget instant messaging :p and I think google wave tried to do something like that, but I've never seen it, and then it died |
| 13:23 |
|
pdurbin |
google hosts mailing lists and chat. have they attempted to integrate the two? |
| 13:23 |
|
aditsu |
they attempted google wave, I don't know exactly what it was |
| 13:24 |
|
aditsu |
oh, apparently it still exists, as apache wave |
| 13:24 |
|
aditsu |
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Wave |
| 13:32 |
|
prologic |
woo! |
| 13:32 |
|
prologic |
factory is now able to bring up docker machines/hsots |
| 13:32 |
|
prologic |
as well as domain names |
| 13:32 |
|
prologic |
and associated them with machines |
| 13:33 |
|
prologic |
Google/Apache wave IHMO isn't quite what we're talking about here |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
I think it was more an experiment in realtime chat |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
with inline responses |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
hence 'wave" |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
I actually did try it once |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
it wasn't that bad |
| 13:34 |
|
prologic |
but I think people didn't "get it" |
| 13:35 |
|
pdurbin |
wave was too much active effort |
| 13:35 |
|
prologic |
precisely |
| 13:36 |
|
prologic |
people with busy lives will just not get involved in such things |
| 13:36 |
|
prologic |
Twitter is great because you can tweet any time you want |
| 13:36 |
|
dotplus |
forums are awful, they're usually a value-negative proposition for me, even if I do end up giving/getting an answer eventually. |
| 13:36 |
|
prologic |
it's like texting |
| 13:36 |
|
prologic |
people get hooked oni t |
| 13:36 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, agreed |
| 13:37 |
|
pdurbin |
prologic: could a bot written in circuits receive a message from a mailing list (I'm thinking Google Groups) and sent me a private message when a new thread is started? |
| 13:37 |
|
aditsu |
twitter is a value-negative proposition for me :p |
| 13:37 |
|
pdurbin |
or somehow poll Google Groups periodially? |
| 13:38 |
|
* pdurbin |
looks at http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3757793/api-for-google-groups |
| 13:38 |
|
prologic |
pdurbin, sure |
| 13:39 |
|
prologic |
pdurbin, I'm pretty sure Google Groups has an API |
| 13:39 |
|
prologic |
so yeah absolutely |
| 13:39 |
|
dotplus |
a threaded message data store with decent search would be best. Then we could have various clients that present/interact like forums, mailing lists, IRC or other approaches according to users' wishes |
| 13:40 |
|
aditsu |
some forum interfaces can be atrocious though |
| 13:40 |
|
dotplus |
it would need to have reasonable namespacing so as to facilitate browsing |
| 13:41 |
|
dotplus |
aditsu: I agree, I wouldn't touch them with a 10' pole, but some people want that. I want to propose a garden where you bring your own user agent toys |
| 13:41 |
|
dotplus |
I don't touch twitter either:) |
| 13:41 |
|
prologic |
I like it! |
| 13:41 |
|
aditsu |
dotplus: I'm the guy who generally prefers forums to mailing lists :p |
| 13:41 |
|
prologic |
"Garden where you bring your own toys" (paraphrasing) |
| 13:42 |
|
dotplus |
I suspect that I'm reinventing usenet with more diverse UA paradigms, but I'm not convinced that's a bad thing |
| 13:44 |
|
aditsu |
so, let's make a generic communication server, with APIs for all types of clients |
| 13:45 |
|
aditsu |
then implement various protocols as client libraries |
| 13:45 |
|
prologic |
that's kind of what I suggested and trying to build already |
| 13:45 |
|
prologic |
but more importantly not just API(s) for all types of clients |
| 13:45 |
|
prologic |
an intelligent communications platform |
| 13:45 |
|
dotplus |
I think this conversation is in the area of "wouldn't it be nice if?" rather than "let's make", but perhaps I'm being pessismistic and/or underestimating y'all |
| 13:46 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, no I think you're right |
| 13:46 |
|
prologic |
such an undertaking is not trivial |
| 13:46 |
|
prologic |
certainly not the ideas I had in mind |
| 13:46 |
|
aditsu |
I think it's doable, but time is the problem |
| 13:46 |
|
prologic |
where you use nlp/Bayesian algos to learn/identify threads of conversations |
| 13:46 |
|
aditsu |
plus expected fighting over details :p |
| 13:47 |
|
dotplus |
prologic: "kind of what I suggested and trying to build already" elaborate? link? |
| 13:47 |
|
prologic |
https://github.com/prologic/charla |
| 13:47 |
|
prologic |
I'm not trying to build an IRC server here ;although it is *that* at present |
| 13:47 |
|
prologic |
but API(s) and other Interface(s) |
| 13:48 |
|
prologic |
because charla is spanish for chat; be it email, form, irc, twitter, whatever |
| 13:48 |
|
aditsu |
prologic: I think thred identification is too ambitious |
| 13:48 |
|
aditsu |
thread* |
| 13:49 |
|
prologic |
not necessarily |
| 13:49 |
|
prologic |
but perhaps :) |
| 13:49 |
|
prologic |
I've always wanted two very improtant tools anyway |
| 13:49 |
|
prologic |
a tool to learn to filter out the noise of twtter |
| 13:49 |
|
prologic |
and a tool to summarize an irc channel's backlog |
| 13:50 |
|
dotplus |
aditsu: time is always the problem:) but there are other problems; I suspect that the biggest is that while we could possibly design/build a reasonable (simple) server-side, even if we limited the initial client interfaces to {forum,mailinglist,IRC} that the client side would be a massive undertaking |
| 13:51 |
|
dotplus |
prologic: if you could come even close to solving that latter, you will be Super {rich,famous,respected} |
| 13:52 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, I agree |
| 13:52 |
|
prologic |
I think doing the server-side would not be all that hard |
| 13:52 |
|
prologic |
I for one suck at UI |
| 13:52 |
|
prologic |
so I'm out :P |
| 13:53 |
|
prologic |
I guess one of the keys things about charla is that it's already pluggable even in it's infancy |
| 13:53 |
|
prologic |
so we could add email/forum/twitter integrations already without too much effort |
| 13:53 |
|
dotplus |
I think aditsu is right and that thread id is too ambitious, but I think that efforts in that area could be worth keeping in mind for the long run. If nothing else, the server-side/protocol should be designed to make that possble |
| 13:53 |
|
prologic |
at least the UI would be just a regular IRC client |
| 13:54 |
|
prologic |
until we found some very smart/clever web designers to build other clients and uis :P |
| 13:57 |
|
dotplus |
oh, mustn't forget a gopher interface |
| 13:57 |
|
prologic |
haha |
| 13:57 |
|
prologic |
easy! |
| 13:57 |
|
dotplus |
I'm serious |
| 13:57 |
|
prologic |
integrate with cgod |
| 13:57 |
|
prologic |
https://github.com/prologic/cgod |
| 13:57 |
|
prologic |
so am i! |
| 13:58 |
|
dotplus |
right. not difficult, but not to be forgotten |
| 13:58 |
|
prologic |
I think I started writing a Gopher irc client too a while back |
| 13:58 |
|
prologic |
nee do finish it |
| 14:01 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, where's your Gopherspace? :) |
| 14:01 |
|
prologic |
Mine's gopher://daisy.shortcircuit.net.au/ |
| 14:02 |
|
prologic |
I've had 1375 uinque visitors |
| 14:02 |
|
prologic |
and 14k hits |
| 14:02 |
|
prologic |
since I started my little Gopherspace |
| 14:02 |
|
prologic |
gopher://daisy.shortcircuit.net.au/h/server-info/stats.html |
| 14:03 |
|
aditsu |
I should invent a protocol called badger :) |
| 14:04 |
|
prologic |
hmm? |
| 14:04 |
|
prologic |
oh haha |
| 14:04 |
|
prologic |
very funny |
| 14:05 |
|
aditsu |
http://www.badgerbadgerbadger.com/ (note: it's fairly loud) |
| 14:05 |
|
pdurbin |
people in wisconsin would love it |
| 14:06 |
|
prologic |
eww |
| 14:06 |
|
prologic |
gross |
| 14:06 |
|
prologic |
How to install Linux on a dead Badger |
| 14:07 |
|
pdurbin |
searchbot: lucky wisconsin badgers |
| 14:07 |
|
searchbot |
pdurbin: http://www.uwbadgers.com/ |
| 14:07 |
|
dotplus |
one of my TODOs is rework my publishing efforts. which basically means translate my (existing) sources from rst (with some metadata) to markdown, rework my publishing workflow from the mess of perl/make/sh to something simpler and migrate the "blog" from custom perl/dancer app to (probably) hugo, possibly pelican if that's still active. And adding gopher support, of course. |
| 14:07 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, seriously? |
| 14:07 |
|
prologic |
just use Pelican |
| 14:08 |
|
prologic |
that sounds too complex/hard |
| 14:08 |
|
dotplus |
what does? |
| 14:08 |
|
prologic |
e.g: http://shortcircuit.net.au/~prologic/blog/ and http://circutisframework.com are both maintained using Pelican |
| 14:08 |
|
prologic |
the later is automated via Travis CI |
| 14:08 |
|
prologic |
http://getpelican.com/ |
| 14:09 |
|
prologic |
best advice you'll ever get from me! |
| 14:09 |
|
prologic |
and you don't need to switch from rst to md |
| 14:09 |
|
prologic |
just change your tooling god damn :) |
| 14:09 |
|
prologic |
I can even show how to do the whole Travis CI setup |
| 14:10 |
|
prologic |
http://circuitsframework.com/ |
| 14:10 |
|
prologic |
apparently I can't type tonight sorry |
| 14:10 |
|
prologic |
also using Pelican |
| 14:11 |
|
dotplus |
well, the rst has some custom metadata that's not supported by markdown. |
| 14:11 |
|
dotplus |
isn't travis proprietary? |
| 14:11 |
|
prologic |
eh? |
| 14:11 |
|
prologic |
the ci service |
| 14:12 |
|
prologic |
I push to https://github.com/circuits/circuits.github.io and Travis CI automatically rebuilds the site and republishes it |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
e.g: vim content/pages/Home.rst && git add -A && git ci -m "..." && git push |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
done |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
site gets rebuilt by Travis CI hook |
| 14:13 |
|
dotplus |
oh. travis is CIaaS. don't want. |
| 14:13 |
|
dotplus |
yeah, that's the kind of workflow I'll be looking for |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
ah |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
why? |
| 14:13 |
|
prologic |
why "don't want"? |
| 14:14 |
|
dotplus |
I'm fundamentally against using aaS for myself. While it's not the only factor in my decisions, it does weigh heavily against. |
| 14:15 |
|
prologic |
oh? |
| 14:15 |
|
prologic |
curious; but why? |
| 14:15 |
|
prologic |
it makes your life so much easier |
| 14:15 |
|
dotplus |
I want to run my own service as much as possible, reduces the chances that I object to the Terms & Conditions:) |
| 14:15 |
|
prologic |
less things to have to build yourself |
| 14:15 |
|
prologic |
oh i see |
| 14:17 |
|
prologic |
I guess you'd consider http://todoapp.vz1.bne.shortcircuit.net.au/ as a SaaS too huh :P |
| 14:17 |
|
dotplus |
sure, less to build, but there's always a price. It's a price I'd rather not pay if I don't have to. As you can see, I use github.com and irc.freenode.net, so this is not an absolute in my life:) |
| 14:17 |
|
prologic |
at least there are not ToS (yet) :P |
| 14:17 |
|
prologic |
yeah yeah sure I understand |
| 14:17 |
|
prologic |
I think I try to do the same more or less |
| 14:18 |
|
prologic |
I guess that's why I still run a lot of my own infrastructure and build a lot of my own tools and tooling |
| 14:18 |
|
prologic |
Docker helps a lot in this space! |
| 14:20 |
|
pdurbin |
semiosis: I <3 jq: get role assignment id more reliably · IQSS/dataverse 5568364 - https://github.com/IQSS/dataverse/commit/5568364 |
| 14:20 |
|
* pdurbin |
will have to catch up on the log later |
| 14:21 |
|
semiosis |
i remember jq. good times. |
| 14:21 |
|
pdurbin |
semiosis: you don't use it anymore?!? |
| 14:21 |
|
semiosis |
it's been a while |
| 14:21 |
|
prologic |
jq is awesome |
| 14:21 |
|
semiosis |
i only used it seriously for the aws cli output, and now aws cli has jmespath embedded in it |
| 14:21 |
|
prologic |
great little tool for querying/filtering json data |
| 14:22 |
|
semiosis |
but i havent even written any aws cli scripts in a bit |
| 14:26 |
|
sivoais |
prologic: I'm stealing that .travis.yml for my ikiwiki pages :-) |
| 14:26 |
|
prologic |
hmm wow |
| 14:26 |
|
prologic |
haha |
| 14:26 |
|
prologic |
oh yeah sure! |
| 14:26 |
|
prologic |
you're welcome! |
| 14:27 |
|
prologic |
don't forget to use https://github.com/prologic/travis-encrypt |
| 14:27 |
|
prologic |
my fork is "installable" |
| 14:27 |
|
prologic |
:) |
| 14:29 |
|
sivoais |
Makefile++ |
| 14:29 |
|
sivoais |
:-D |
| 14:34 |
|
pdurbin |
mmm, ikiwiki |
| 14:35 |
|
prologic |
wut? |
| 14:37 |
|
pdurbin |
searchbot: lucky ikiwiki |
| 14:37 |
|
searchbot |
pdurbin: https://ikiwiki.info/ |
| 14:37 |
|
prologic |
https://gist.github.com/prologic/509c96a5df513923a09d |
| 14:37 |
|
pdurbin |
git-backed wiki. I use it at http://wiki.greptilian.com |
| 14:37 |
|
prologic |
oh! |
| 14:37 |
|
prologic |
http://sahriswiki.org |
| 14:37 |
|
prologic |
Mercurial backed wiki :P |
| 14:38 |
|
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| 14:40 |
|
prologic |
as far as wikis go it doesn't look/sound too bad really |
| 14:40 |
|
prologic |
ikiwiki that is |
| 14:42 |
|
pdurbin |
this is a nice ikiwiki: https://trygvis.io/rest-wiki |
| 14:45 |
|
prologic |
so are we gonna build this chat thing? :P |
| 14:46 |
|
prologic |
I'm thinking rethinkdb is going to be the perfect data store |
| 14:47 |
|
dotplus |
because? |
| 14:47 |
|
prologic |
realtime |
| 14:49 |
|
* pdurbin |
has heard good things about rethinkdb |
| 14:50 |
|
dotplus |
likewise, although I haven't played with it. |
| 14:51 |
|
pdurbin |
me neither |
| 14:51 |
|
dotplus |
the realtime aspect is a push vs. pull argument, right? |
| 14:52 |
|
dotplus |
Am I understanding their spiel correctly: generally, large scale systems do better as pull, but rethinkdb makes/intends to make push viable at a larger scale |
| 14:53 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, I believe so |
| 14:54 |
|
prologic |
I guess the biggest thing I can see |
| 14:54 |
|
prologic |
is that rethinkdb is designed for realtime changes/notifications of the datasets in realtime |
| 14:56 |
|
pdurbin |
I'm not even sure what we'd be building. I hope someone volunteers to write a design document. :) |
| 14:57 |
|
dotplus |
indeed, the first step is get some vision on what we're trying to achieve. every project is doomed without that. |
| 14:58 |
|
dotplus |
that's why I tried to make something like a spec for addressbookmvc |
| 14:59 |
|
* prologic |
volunteers |
| 14:59 |
|
prologic |
:P |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
but I'm going to bed |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
Sat Jul 11 01:04:25 AEST 2015 |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
uggh |
| 15:00 |
|
pdurbin |
'night! |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
$ factory rm |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
Removing machine: test ... OK |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
Deleting domain: myrandomdomain.com ... OK |
| 15:00 |
|
pdurbin |
dotplus: thank for for that |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
g'night :) |
| 15:00 |
|
aditsu |
your clock is 4 min fast |
| 15:00 |
|
pdurbin |
thank you* |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
BS! |
| 15:00 |
|
prologic |
ohw ell |
| 15:01 |
|
prologic |
oh well |
| 15:01 |
|
prologic |
I never bothered to setup ntp at home this time around |
| 15:02 |
|
aditsu |
g'night :) |
| 15:03 |
|
dotplus |
pdurbin: the basic idea is that everyone has their own preferences about communication interfaces to communities: web based forums, mailing lists, IRC, nntp, etc. Each has their advantages and disadvantages. let's build a service/protocol that defines how messages/conversations are transferred/stored and allows protocol-compliant user agents to participate while leaving decisions about the presentation paradigm to the UA. |
| 15:04 |
|
pdurbin |
interesting |
| 15:04 |
|
pdurbin |
ambitious |
| 15:05 |
|
dotplus |
that decoupling would allow people to use their preferred paradigm (mailing list, sms, irc, whatever) to join in the same community/conversations as others who want to use different UAs |
| 15:06 |
|
dotplus |
effectively, a many-to-many gateway service for messaging protocols. |
| 15:12 |
|
dotplus |
we'll need to define a few things: 1) a message 2) a thread ("conversation") 3) namespacing (analagous to channel/forum/list/group in IRC/forums/mailinglists/news respectively) |
| 15:15 |
|
dotplus |
other (big?) issues in no particular order: storage, authentication/RBAC, active search, tagging or other approaches to "browse" i.e. searching when you don't know what you want, approach to distributed: federated vs. peer2peer, etc. |
| 15:20 |
|
pdurbin |
related: https://meta.discourse.org/t/using-discourse-as-a-chat-application/3436 |
| 15:21 |
|
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| 16:05 |
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| 16:58 |
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| 21:55 |
|
prologic |
dotplus, nice description |
| 21:55 |
|
prologic |
that's exactly one major part of this |
| 21:56 |
|
prologic |
the other ambitious part is like I said about trying to cope with the noise |
| 22:30 |
|
dotplus |
noise? you mean as in signal-to-noise ratio, trolls, etc.? well, the basic level is RBAC ("if you don't behave, you get banned (by whoever is given rights) ") |
| 22:32 |
|
dotplus |
but automating that is a major AI project |
| 22:36 |
|
pdurbin |
so we're thinking about calling the new mailing list about programming "sourcefu" and have it be an alternative communication option aside from this channel. or the list might be its own new thing. please feel free to add ideas and vote: http://www.tricider.com/brainstorming/2jbXuCO0CgF |
| 22:57 |
|
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