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IRC log for #javaee, 2013-09-09

Please see http://irclog.greptilian.com/javaee for which days have been logged.

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time S Nick Message
01:50 raulsh joined ##javaee
03:17 scripty joined ##javaee
03:21 scripty who is
03:21 scripty Philip Durbin ?
03:23 scripty I dont like to spam can anyone shout here
03:23 scripty IS it sfisque ?
03:25 scripty I dont know who you are ... U have Cool Things ....Thank U
03:37 scripty Is it Quest .......No suspense please :(
03:40 grug it'd probably help if you could put together a coherent sentence
03:46 sfisque i'm not sure what the question is
03:48 scripty :D
03:49 scripty who is  Philip Durbin ?
03:49 grug why the fuck would we know?
03:50 grug he owns greptilian.com
03:50 grug http://greptilian.com/
03:50 grug that is him
03:50 scripty grug if you dont know fuck dont type
03:50 grug what the fuck, are you some 12 year old
03:50 grug stop being a dipshit
03:50 scripty Fuck YOU mORON
03:51 scripty 12 years OLD mf
03:54 scripty was kicked by sfisque: scripty
03:55 * sfisque sighs
03:55 sfisque first kick i've had to do
03:59 jaya_ joined ##javaee
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07:04 joshua_jandyco joined ##javaee
07:06 joshua_jandyco joined ##javaee
09:49 SoniEx joined ##javaee
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09:58 scripty joined ##javaee
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10:41 manulite joined ##javaee
12:12 Quest joined ##javaee
12:28 kobain joined ##javaee
13:28 acuzio joined ##javaee
13:29 acuzio Hi all
13:29 pdurbin acuzio: hi
13:30 acuzio I want to do REST server without Servlets
13:30 Stephmw joined ##javaee
13:32 tjsnell RAILS
13:32 acuzio no in Java
13:32 acuzio Java EE
13:32 pdurbin heh
13:35 pdurbin I thought Java EE was built on Servlets
13:35 manulite joined ##javaee
13:36 Quest servlets is part of java ee
13:36 Naros joined ##javaee
13:37 pdurbin acuzio: you might want to ask in #rest. whartung hangs out there too
13:37 sfisque you're going to reinvent a fairly big square wheel if you plan on doing REST without servlets.  (assuming you're intending on doing it in java)
13:39 acuzio why do we need Servlets
13:40 pdurbin for request/response
13:40 acuzio i want to know what Quest did
13:41 Quest sorry?
13:41 acuzio i thought you did REST
13:42 acuzio or something without Servlets
13:42 Quest me. not
13:43 Quest acuzio,  "most" things are based on servlets . even many frameworks (despite some dont use servlets at all).
13:43 Quest acuzio,  i never did REST
13:43 Quest or SOAP
13:46 Naros We use REST here but it is based on Servlets.
13:46 pdurbin I think there's a Java framework or two that isn't based on servlets
13:46 Naros But I concur with sfisque; not using servlets would be akin of reinventing the wheel imo.
13:47 Naros that time is better spent elsewhere imo
13:49 acuzio so Quest you didnt
13:50 acuzio I am quite disappointed
13:50 Quest acuzio,  why ? :)
13:51 Quest acuzio,  you are not my grandma. are you?
13:51 acuzio well no
13:52 acuzio i was interested to hear your experience thats all
13:52 acuzio Are you all stillusing the single nick
13:52 acuzio So Quest is like an aggregated response
13:53 Quest 6 months before, I started coding in java.  touched, java se, ee, jsp servlets, spring , spring security, hibernate. made about 50 apps. se+ee
13:53 Quest and java fx
13:53 Quest founded this channel because of my interest and passion in java. thats all i gues.
13:54 Quest acuzio,  you ?
13:54 acuzio wow 50 apps
13:54 Quest sorry. 20
13:54 Quest bad typo
13:55 sfisque consider it this way.  REST is based on http.  so you're either going to use servlets, OR you're going to re-invent about 16 years of stable code
13:55 acuzio so are you all still using Quest
13:55 acuzio as a common nick
13:55 Quest I am the only one who use this nick. why ?
13:55 acuzio really
13:56 acuzio i was sure therre were like 4 of you guys
13:56 acuzio at least
13:56 Naros Nope, just know Quest from here when I helped him/her with some hibernate stuffs a few months back.
13:57 Naros beyond that, Quest and I are on two completely different continents :P
13:57 acuzio Naros: Quest is a guy or at least one of them is
13:57 Naros I have never asked so :P
13:58 acuzio What happens if i have 2 requests coming to a HTTP server from the same IP- is the Session reused ?
13:58 Naros Depends on the browser.
13:58 Naros If both are in the same browser, just different tabs, it might.
13:58 acuzio it might -
13:59 acuzio ?
13:59 acuzio hmm - what does that mean ?
13:59 Naros The browser sends a session id to the app server.
13:59 Quest I am the only one who use this nick. acuzio
13:59 Naros depending on the browser's implementation, it might send the same session id or get assigned a new one if one isn't presented.
14:00 acuzio So the browser decides ?
14:00 Naros we generally find we have to test with two different browsers to simulate two different sessions.
14:00 Quest acuzio,  the session is maintained by the browser also. so it depends
14:00 acuzio What happens to the server then ?
14:01 Naros if no session is presented to the app server, the app server assigned a new one to the browser and it is then responsible for sending that session information on each subsequent future request.
14:01 Naros all the server does is maintains a list of session ids to a map of session objects.
14:02 Naros so that when a request comes in and a session id matches what the browser submits, the session's server side representation can be reconstructed and used for that request
14:02 acuzio What happens at the first request ?
14:03 Naros browser sends request, server sees no session id provided and webapp server says, ok your session is now XYZ an sends that to the browser.  The browser says thank you and stores it.  On future requests, the broser sends XYZ back to the server so the server can lookup it's session data.
14:03 Naros it's a bit more complicated ofc, but that's the gist.
14:03 Quest acuzio,  why did tjsnell  called you a trouble maker?
14:04 Quest he is the op in #java i think
14:04 tjsnell I'm a good judge of character
14:04 * Quest hides
14:04 acuzio Quest: no i called him a trouble maker
14:04 tjsnell you think?
14:04 * Quest hides not to be character judged
14:04 Naros Can't judge me, I'm just pixels on a screen :P
14:04 acuzio Quest: he got banned from ##swearing remember
14:05 Quest tjsnell,  wht troubles did he made ?
14:05 acuzio Quest: he stinks
14:05 acuzio Quest: its known that tjsnell bathes once a week
14:06 tjsnell lies!
14:06 Naros you realize that is customary in some cultures yes? >.<
14:06 acuzio really - what culture
14:07 pdurbin can we talk about java ee instead?
14:08 acuzio we might
14:08 Naros pdurbin: fine w/me, just pointing out people are different and doesn't constitute negative commentary.
14:08 Quest acuzio,  no personal abuse please.
14:09 acuzio Quest: what personal abuse ?
14:09 pdurbin so, I'm actively working on a REST API but it does use servlets. I don't know how else I would do it
14:09 acuzio so Quest what abuse
14:11 Quest <acuzio> Quest: he stinks
14:11 Naros pdurbin: lots of reinventing of the wheel :P
14:11 pdurbin Naros: yeah
14:11 Naros and in the end, would look just like the servlet code likely with lots of gaps :P
14:12 acuzio Quest: thats not abuse - thats just the truth
14:12 Quest acuzio,  not here please :)
14:12 pdurbin acuzio: have you found alternatives to servelets? what does google tell you?
14:12 pdurbin servlets*
14:13 tjsnell just because something is customary in a culture doesn't suddenly make it OK or non offensive
14:13 pdurbin crimsonfubot: google alternatives to java servlets
14:13 crimsonfubot pdurbin: What, besides servlets and jsp, may be used for web-application ...: <http://www.coderanch.com/t/524463/Servlets/java/servlets-jsp-web-application>; Java Servlets - MSDN - Microsoft: <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa478987.aspx>; When the Servlet Model Doesn't Serve: <http://www.kcjava.org/media/ServletModel.pdf>; Java Servlet Programming -- Chapter 3 - O'Reilly Media: (2 more messages)
14:13 tjsnell some cultures it's OK to eat your enemy
14:13 sfisque here's an analogy.  doing something http related and not using servlets would be like writing your own ArrayList or Double class
14:14 sfisque mmmmmm….. roasted enemy…… aaaaaggghghghgththhghgh
14:15 acuzio Quest: he started it
14:16 acuzio In my culture its customary to eat your enemy - now he is offending me
14:16 Quest acuzio,  be on topic please :)
14:16 Naros ...
14:17 sfisque on a sober note, i used the /kick cmd for the first time last night.  had to kick scripty
14:18 acuzio Quest: how come i am the only one being asked to stan topic - i didnt start it , i actually asked a real question
14:18 acuzio stay on
14:19 Quest java.net.ConnectException: Connection timed outat java.net.PlainSocketImpl.socketConnect(Native Method)    .   I have put the socket in try catch block. and catching it with Logger class. why my app stops at timout then?
14:19 sfisque is your app sending or receiving?
14:19 Quest acuzio,  yes. what were you asking then? :)
14:19 Quest sfisque,  both
14:20 sfisque well, the send will timeout if no one accepts the connection.  the recieve will timeout if no one connects.  are you using ServerSocket for the recieving end?
14:20 sfisque ServerSocket will block until someone connects to it
14:20 acuzio Isnt that normal JAva -
14:21 sfisque depends.
14:21 Quest simple socket
14:21 sfisque not if you're writing a JCA adapter :P
14:21 Quest no iam not
14:21 Quest connecting to a service at some port
14:21 Quest works ok but times out after a while.
14:21 sfisque aye, i was just saying that low level socket services are sometimes necessary in EE
14:22 Quest but why my app stops there with exception contrary to that i have handled the exception
14:22 Quest sfisque,  its an non=EE
14:22 Quest app.
14:22 sfisque i know
14:22 * sfisque sighs
14:22 Quest strange. isnt it. if the exception is handled. no matter of time out. it should continue
14:22 Quest right?
14:23 sfisque depends.  is the exception being thrown inside or outside the try block
14:23 sfisque also, is it really an exception or is it an Error?
14:23 sfisque or a subclass of RuntimeException
14:23 acuzio or throeable
14:25 acuzio I want to connect to a Database in my EJB ?
14:25 acuzio its a CMP running on Websphere
14:26 Quest sfisque,  its this to be exact. v
14:26 Quest http://pastebin.com/2EM0D0Fb
14:27 acuzio wheres the code ?
14:27 sfisque you have an NPE
14:28 sfisque Q.  i'm guessing you're calling .connect on a null Socket object
14:28 sfisque but that might just be my lumbago acting up
14:30 Quest ya. on socket.close. in finally but a timeout at start of conection
14:31 sfisque well lets look at ConnectionException
14:31 sfisque ok so it extends Exception so it's catchable in a proper situation
14:32 Quest ya.
14:32 Quest I have added exception
14:32 sfisque so what's on line 47 of bf.main
14:32 sfisque because that's where you're exception is being thrown
14:32 Quest UnknownHostException IOException Exception
14:32 sfisque ah, DNS issue
14:33 Quest 47 is new Socket..
14:33 Quest the host must have blocked too many request. but the app should not diey
14:33 Quest die*
14:34 sfisque negative.  you're getting an NPE in your finallly block.  you might need a null gate in there
14:34 sfisque for cases where the Socket constructor collapses
14:34 acuzio Quest: yes , hosts do that - block too many requests
14:36 sfisque generally when you're boot strapping a service consumption you might want to use something benign and "highly available", then switch when you're starting to do the nitty gritty stuff
14:36 sfisque try just connecting to google's search engine or a local webservice
14:36 acuzio can someone answer my question
14:36 sfisque what's the quest Acu
14:37 acuzio Connect to a DB in my EJB
14:38 sfisque that's a statement.  what's the question?  how? what?  where? when?
14:40 acuzio HOw do i do it -
14:40 acuzio its a Websphere CMP bean
14:40 Quest sfisque,  java.net.ConnectException: Connection timed out again
14:41 sfisque are you trying to use the connection pool from an EJB, servlet, CDI bean, JSF ManagedBean or POJO?
14:42 acuzio i am trying to use it from an EJB
14:42 sfisque Q: i'm guessing they might have a "limit per IP" gate if it's a free service
14:42 sfisque aka, each IP gets X connects per minute/hour/day/whatever
14:43 acuzio sfisque: oh you are talking about Quest's problem
14:43 sfisque both, i'm multitasking :P
14:43 Quest sfisque,  yes. but my app should not crash. but continue after the exception.... thats what i was insisting
14:43 sfisque Acu: do you have a persistence.xml in your project that bootstraps JPA?
14:43 Quest sfisque,  multithreading that is
14:44 sfisque Q: if you get an exception outsdie the try block, it will crash.  the stack traces indicate you have an NPE in the finally block, because the Socket is faililng in it's constructor.  you need a null gate in the finally block
14:45 Stephmw left ##javaee
14:45 sfisque Acu: if you have a persistence.xml set up, you need to annotate an EntityManager injection in your EJB (@PersistenceContext EntityManager em; blah blah blah)
14:45 sfisque and then use the EntityManager to build or execute queries
14:45 acuzio from within the CMP
14:50 sfisque cmp is just a technology.
15:06 acuzio oh
15:10 tjsnell it's not magic
15:32 acuzio really
16:06 kobain joined ##javaee
16:17 znurgl joined ##javaee
17:03 scripty joined ##javaee
17:18 Quest sfisque,  the exception is for the things those are inside the try block ofcourse. still it crashes
17:19 Quest sfisque,  the finaly block itself had try block
17:19 Quest sfisque,  what do you mean by null gate?
17:21 sfisque null gate:   if( x != null ) { use x } else { handle the case where x == null };
17:21 Quest oh
17:21 Quest if (socket != null) {socket.close()}  right?
17:25 sfisque aye
17:59 Quest joined ##javaee
18:38 scripty joined ##javaee
18:38 scripty left ##javaee
18:45 tjsnell was kicked by Quest: tjsnell
18:45 tjsnell joined ##javaee
18:45 tjsnell was kicked by Quest: tjsnell
18:45 tjsnell joined ##javaee
18:48 Quest are jsoup and other parsers doing regex in the backend to get tags by name such as <a> or <p> ?
18:54 tjsnell does it matter?
18:55 tjsnell but most likely no because regex sucks for parsing
19:03 Quest yup.
19:03 Quest performance analysing
19:07 Questy_ joined ##javaee
19:07 Questing what a fucking liar you are quest
19:07 Questing hahaha
19:09 dreamreal joined ##javaee
19:10 questthechickenl joined ##javaee
19:10 questthechickenl dishonesty!
19:10 questthechickenl lie and pretent
19:10 questthechickenl hypocrite
19:12 Quest boy I love it. like a pay back time :)
19:12 Quest I am even now.
19:19 russellw joined ##javaee
19:20 regedit joined ##javaee
19:21 whaley joined ##javaee
19:21 whaley left ##javaee
19:42 sfisque you pose this question…. why?
19:42 Quest sfisque,  he is on +q (cant speak)
19:42 sfisque ah
19:43 Quest sfisque,  it is now public that some ops in ##java found me dumb. and I found (either they are correct or not) that they ,despit, dont have  any right to insult / abuse.
19:43 sfisque so we have a channel war?  /sigh
19:44 Quest what can I say :) bad start on their side. I wont like a war or offtopic thing
19:44 Quest waste of time...
19:45 sfisque aye
19:45 tjsnell This ##java op has never disrupted this channel
19:46 tjsnell wish the reciprocal was the same
19:48 Quest take this to ##javaee-offtopic if you want to. not here.
19:49 Quest tjsnell, ^
19:49 tjsnell nah, thanks, Just responding to comments made here, no desire to join that channel
19:50 Topic for ##javaee is now Core Java (Java SE) AND Java Enterprise Edition (Java EE) discussion | ##javaee-offtopic for all kinds of non-tech chat| logs at http://irclog.greptilian.com/javaee/today
19:53 sfisque i don't even belong to ##java
19:56 sfisque except, now that i've perused my scrollback, we don't need that kind of language in here.
19:56 sfisque i already had to /kick someone last night.
19:56 Quest take this to ##javaee-offtopic if you want to. not here.
19:57 sfisque lots of 4 letter explitives.  we can leave it at that
19:57 Naros occured about 60 minutes ago.
19:58 Naros Yes, it was slightly prior to your join.
20:00 Chiyo joined ##javaee
20:00 Chiyo test
20:01 Naros All I can concur with is sfisque's observation and stance that the language isn't necessary.
20:01 Naros Hi Chiyo.
20:01 Chiyo hello :)
20:01 sfisque the kick was last night.  first one i've done, since becoming an op weeks ago
20:03 sfisque so, anywho… i'm having lots of fun refactoring out sesion scoped CDI's from the workflow i'm converting to an Asynch.  fun fun fun…..
20:03 Naros haha, i'll come do that while you do all this TSQL code for me :P
20:04 sfisque glassfish.  but doesnt matter.  session scoped == non-thread safe, thus must be removed from an Asynch workflow
20:04 sfisque naros : not on your life :P
20:04 sfisque you cannot guarantee the life cycle of the session scoped bean while you're in a worker thread
20:05 Naros you can guarantee a kaboom tho!
20:05 Naros massive explosions and lots of fireworks :P
20:05 sfisque that.. yes.. .you can guarantee that :P
20:05 sfisque or as i like to label it… the "smoking crater"
20:05 Naros reminds me of worker threads dereferencing an invalid pointer in c++
20:06 sfisque pretty much analogous
20:06 Naros when those hit real users, things get nasty fast :E
20:07 sfisque aye, just elucidating for the channel, since we have all levels of members in here.  good to be "pedantic" occasionally for the neophytes
20:08 Naros sfisque: Speaking of smoking ..... i suspect that's what is happening to my db server right now lol.
20:08 Naros doing a massive client data load of around 350 million records
20:09 Naros those poor discs :P
20:09 sfisque i bet when its done, it'll be smoking… the good stuff.. to forget the pain :P
20:09 Naros yah
20:10 denny joined ##javaee
20:10 sfisque hey, what's the smell coming from the machine room… oh… i know that smell....
20:10 sfisque door opens, to the sound of a db server coughing and wheezing
20:10 sfisque wearing a dead shirt and a bandana
20:11 sfisque both tie dye of course
20:11 Naros yep, with a sign on the wall that reads, "if we had only went with oracle instead of mssql" :P
20:12 sfisque "if we had only went with oracle instead of mssql….. dude...."
20:12 Naros lawlz, yah we have an old Oracle 8i db running Oracle 11.03 in the server room and that chokes repeatedly.
20:12 Naros old ibm aix :E
20:12 russellw left ##javaee
20:12 sfisque aix had some interesting features
20:13 Naros :)
20:13 Naros but the worse part is having to rebuild the lucene search index on all that data
20:14 sfisque wierdst bug i ever tracked down.  swing app that failed to launch on aix.  turned out, the Xwin subsystem is completely multi-threaded on AIX.  so calls like "new Window();" would return instantly and you'd get all sorts of NPEs if you didnt use wait/notify
20:14 Naros now that's some funny mess.
20:14 Naros gotta love people who write code and forget about those wonderful features.
20:14 sfisque yah. we were like. WTF, it runs fine on EVERY other platform including HPUX, solaris, etc.
20:15 sfisque then i stepped through the code on an aix box and did some searching via alta-vista (google hadnt debuted yet)
20:15 sfisque and voila… all we needed was to insert some wait/notifies and everything was happy
20:15 sfisque yah,  i LOVED alta-vista's "near" operator
20:15 Naros yah the early days of the interwebz.
20:15 sfisque really culled down queries fast
20:22 regedit left ##javaee
20:49 SoniEx2 joined ##javaee
21:25 denny left ##javaee
22:58 Chiyo left ##javaee
23:10 * pdurbin wonders if he should skip reading today's log...
23:11 tjsnell that's a good policy :)
23:19 pdurbin it's actually not as bad as I thought it'd be. code strong!
23:20 pdurbin with apologies to sfisque :)
23:33 tjsnell he's offended by code strong?
23:49 SoniEx2 joined ##javaee

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Please see http://irclog.greptilian.com/javaee for which days have been logged.